ABBAS AGABA is the MP for Kitagwenda county in Kamwenge. A first-term legislator, he told Edris Kiggundu why NRM must not stifle internal competition and how contradictions are good for the party.
Briefly what is your impression so far of the 10th parliament?
Initially there was excitement about parliament from all sides. All of us had just won elections and there was that excitement. It has been that period of learning, settling in and understanding the kind of work we are supposed to be doing.
Some of us are still in court and some people are not able to express themselves. But secondly, some of us discovered that if you only keep at parliament alone as a source of livelihood, it is a problem. It is not right for people to take it as formal employment. You do your work as MP but also it is good to base somewhere else to get some income.
But the public feeling persists that many of you have turned it into a formal job. That is why MPs constantly demand better pay and benefits.
I agree with you. There are many people who see parliament as a quick route to gaining wealth but, on the other hand, there is still a big team that has come to serve. It is a mixed bag. That said, I think as MPs, we are too many. With a population of 37 million, we need about 200 MPs.
In NRM, we are too many MPs. You find about five people talking about the same thing on the floor. For the opposition, they are fewer but they appear to outshine the NRM. The most important point is to ensure that the concerns of your people go through. But also an MP should be able to talk about issues that affect the country.
Some of you make promises on the campaign trail that are untenable. In the end, it affects your overall performance.
If this is the case, then the people who vote for us have a problem too. The point is; people vote you into parliament to represent them, attract services.
Yet even when you do this, there are some other personal expectations, which cause problems. You finance many demands such as paying school fees, funding widows, burials.
Part of the problem is that politicians have commercialized politics.
The unfortunate legacy that the NRM is leaving behind is the monetization of politics. A liberation struggle like that of NRM should have cleaned politics and provided ground for the best candidate to win.
A person like Dr Milton Obote came from Akokoro (in Apac) with just a small paper containing his speech. He went to the delegates’ conference and he was voted as UPC president. He did not have money. But these days you must have money to be elected. If you don’t have money, it becomes difficult.
I expected our president to be strict and say whoever uses money should be thrown out but now it is going to be hard. When you monetize politics, then voters ask for it, not services.
President Museveni appears to have overbearing influence on the actions of the NRM MPs through the caucus. Doesn’t this affect the independence of the legislature?
When you allow one organ of the party to override others, you bring problems. The Central Executive Committee (CEC) headed by the president has in the recent past nominated people for the Pan African Parliament.
They have nominated commissioners for parliament and some people are watching to see if they will nominate NRM EALA representatives. This is not good. This means we have conceded that we as the caucus cannot decide on NRM issues. We have surrendered this role to CEC. This power must come back to parliament. We should have elections and primaries. We want NRM to be a competitive party even without Museveni. We want NRM to be there even after Museveni.
When the party amended its constitution and made some positions appointive, don’t you think this was bad for internal democracy?
I have been a member of CEC and my personal opinion is, I don’t think that having a bigger portion appointed by the chairman is the right way for the party to function well. A secretary general is the heart of the party. I have my own qualities of a secretary general.
One, he/she must be clear on the ideology of the party, secondly he/she should have good mobilization skills, thirdly he/she should be loyal to the party and lastly he/she should have administrative skills. When you make the position appointive, it is only loyalty to the party that is considered and others are secondary. Appointments don’t normally follow merit. This is dangerous. In future we should change this to allow for internal growth.
At that time, some people including Museveni feared that an elected secretary general could become powerful and challenge the chairman.
If a party is going to become strong, it must allow these contradictions to play out. It must allow competition. Let us allow for the contradictions to come in and we deal with them. It is not wrong for contradictions to emerge; it is wrong to fail to have a mechanism to deal with or fail to learn from them.
The public is angry with the MP’s increasing demand for perks and other benefits at the expense of the taxpayer.
The public anger is misdirected. This parliament is the least paid in the region. In South Sudan, an MP earns $15,000, in Rwanda it is $10,000, in Tanzania it is $15,000, in Kenya it is $20,000. What we earn is less than $10,000 per month.
Secondly, there is this hullabaloo over taxing some of the MPs’ allowances. This has been blown out of proportion by the civil society and media. Our salary is taxed but what we contend is that mileage allowance should not be taxed. If you gave me 200 litres of fuel to go to Serere and back and then you tax it, it means I will not have enough fuel to go past Soroti. Slowly and slowly, our people will understand.
The rules committee where you are a deputy chairman summoned some editors over what you termed as negative reporting of parliament. Don’t you think you overstepped your power?
Zambia has a more comprehensive approach that deals with the relationship between parliament and the media. In Zambia actually, if you are a media house and you misreport, they can call you and take action. Our summoning of the media houses, we think, was within the law.
But as you know, some media houses did not come including The Observer. We have written a report which has not yet been presented on the floor of the House. I am hesitant to talk about the details of the report but we have made some good proposals.
There is the media council and the courts of law. Why doesn’t parliament appeal to these if they feel aggrieved by the way journalists report about the institution?
The media says for them they are the fourth estate so to summon them to parliament is to cajole them. But let us wait for the report; I think there are some interesting proposals.
What have you liked about the 10th parliament?
There is a lot of energy. The people are young. It is quite ambitious. If we keep this same pace, we will do better. The people are aggressive and inquisitive.
What about the dislikes?
Our numbers are affecting our level of debate because the speaker has to apportion a short time for each MP to speak. Sometimes you are given two minutes and you can’t conceptualize your issue properly.
Which MP(s) inspire you?
We have good debaters. The speaker (Rebecca Kadaga) has been an inspiration to many. The deputy speaker (Jacob Oulanyah) is also good. When Abdu Katuntu (Bugweri) comes to speak, you see he is prepared. Then leader of the opposition (Winnie Kiiza) is very organized too.
ekiggundu@observer.ug